Episode 461 – Mysteries, Corgis, and Ghosts on “Pride Street” with T. Thorn Coyle

Aug 26, 2024 | 4 comments

Jeff & Will discuss what they’ve been reading and watching recently, including Elite on Netflix, Joanna Lumley’s Britain on Amazon Prime, My Stand-In on iQIYI, and Prince of the Palisades by Julian Winters.

Cozy Mystery Month continues with author T. Thorn Coyle talking about the Pride Street Paranormal series, including two new books coming out this fall—Hairspray Horror and Dandy Distress. Thorn shares the inspirations for Garrett and John, the corgis Marsha and Klaus, and the ghost Adam. We also find out about their other series, which all include elements of magic and justice, and their latest non-fiction book for authors.

Look for the next episode of Big Gay Fiction Podcast on Monday, September 9.

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Show Notes

Here are the things we talk about in this episode. Please note, these links include affiliate links for which we may make a small commission at no extra cost to you should you make a purchase. These links are current at the time the episode premieres, however links are subject to change.

Transcript 

This transcript was made possible by our community on Patreon. You can get information on how to join them at patreon.com/biggayfictionpodcast.

Intro

Will: Coming up on this episode, cozy mystery month continues with T. Thorn Coyle and their “Pride Street Paranormal” series.

Jeff: Welcome to episode 461 of the Big Gay fiction podcast, the show for avid readers and passionate fans of queer romance fiction. I’m Jeff, and here with me is my co-host and husband, Will.

Will: Hello, Rainbow Romance Reader. It is so great to have you back for another episode.

Jeff: As always, the podcast is brought to you in part by our remarkable community on Patreon. If you’d like more information about what we offer to our patrons, including the opportunity to ask questions to our guests, go to patreon.com/biggayfictionpodcast.

Recommendations

Will: So before we get to this week’s interview, we wanted to take a moment and kind of fill you in on what we’ve been watching recently.

Elite

Will: Recently, the Netflix series “Elite” finished up its eight season run. We have been longtime fans of this show about ultra-wealthy Spanish teens. And collectively over the eight seasons, there has been plenty of queer content, plus lots of sex and drugs and murder.

Jeff: As one does in prep school.

Will: And I think overall season eight was good. As some other shows have recently shown, it is sometimes hard to stick the landing. And I think in the case of “Elite,” it wrap things up, maybe not exceptionally, but admirably.

Jeff: Yeah, I would agree with that. And I really liked what season eight did, bringing back some characters we haven’t seen in a while, particularly Omar’s sister. And Yeah, I really liked it. And honestly, there’s some spinoffs I would like to see there because I would really like to see what Isadora does with the rest of her life cause she, to me, was one of the most fascinating characters through the entire series. But really enjoyed it. Glad we got to cap that off.

Joanna Lumley’s Britian

Will: But if sex, drugs and murder aren’t your thing, don’t worry. We have got you covered. If you’d like something a little more gentle, we both highly recommend the travel log series, “Joanna Lumley’s Britain.” And this is a show that, you know, does exactly what it says on the tin. It’s a very lovely, peaceful look at what makes Britain so very special hosted by “AbFab’s” Joanna Lumley.

Jeff: It was just a lovely piece of travel log and honestly, this is my bad. I don’t know Joanna Lumley really beyond “AbFab” because that’s where I discovered her. But you get little pieces as she like revisits “Coronation Street” where she had a stint and she goes off to the “Bond” test track, well, it wasn’t the “Bond” test track, it was the car’s test track, but we find out she was in a “Bond” movie, which I had no idea about. It was really lovely. I just loved it to pieces.

Will: You can check out “Joanna Lumley’s Britain”, as well as some of her other travel shows, on Amazon Prime.

My Stand-In

Will: We also wanna quickly mention that we really enjoy the Thai BL drama, “My Stand-In.” And to kind of quickly summarize, which isn’t always easy when it comes to BL dramas, this show is about Joe, a stunt man, and he is drawn to the toxically self-absorbed Ming, and he’s the son of a wealthy family. And after a fatal accident, Joe wakes up in the body of a recently awakened coma patient, who is conveniently also named Joe.

And it’s at this point that he returns to his previous profession and he starts things back up with Ming. But the main question that needs to be answered is, can they get things right the second time around? There is an awful lot to love about this show. It’s got a head banging theme song. There’s lots of work and life and family drama. And of course it’s a given that has a gorgeous and incredibly talented cast.

Jeff: I really loved this show. It’s an interesting take on a second chance romance that you have somebody waking up in another body and giving it another go. And I like how they get to spread the story out over these episodes because we find out why Ming is the way that he is. And we learn so much about, really who Joe is as he kind of adapts to being in this other body. I just cannot recommend this highly enough. It was such a delightful watch.

Will: If this sounds good to you, “My Stand-In” can be viewed on iQIYI at iq.com.

And Tango Makes Three by Peter Parnell & Justin Richardson

Jeff: And I’ve got a couple books that I wanna talk about. First off, I wanna let you know about a brand new edition of the children’s book “And Tango Makes Three” by Peter Parnell and Justin Richardson. Now we spotlighted this classic and groundbreaking story about two male penguins at the Central Park Zoo who are raising a baby penguin back at episode 381 as part of our 2022 Pride Month programming. Peter and Justin joined us to talk about the book and how it has been banned numerous times since its publication 20 plus years ago.

For this new paperback, which is called a School and Library Edition, there’s a brand new afterward from Eliot Schrefer, the author of “Queer Ducks (and Other Animals),” and Justin and Peter wrote a special note for educators on the freedom to read. You can find this edition on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, bookshop.org, and anywhere else you pick up paperbacks. It can be great for yourself, maybe kids in your life, or as a gift perhaps for a local school or library.

In this election year, the freedom to read is definitely on the ballots as we decide on local officials who run our libraries and our school boards. So there’s no better time to get some education on book bans and read a delightful story about penguins.

Prince of the Palisades by Julian Winters

Jeff: I also wanna tell you about the latest from Julian Winters. I am such a huge fan of his books that I was so excited that “Prince of the Palisades” recently came out. It is so accurately described by the line in its blurb that says it’s “Young Royals” meets “Red, White and Royal Blue.”

We meet Prince Jadon after he has been essentially exiled to America after a video has gone viral showing him behaving badly. There’s reasons he’s behaving badly though, and that’s one of the things that he has to come to grips with, and if he’s actually going to talk about what happened that made him react so badly.

But he’s dispatched to America to try to clean up his image. Now he’s not the crown prince in this instance. The next in line for the throne is his sister, but he’s still expected to behave as a proper prince. When he sent over to America, he’s also going to an American prep school. And now he’s surrounded by a bunch of kids all of whom come from upper class families, alongside some kids who are there on scholarship as well. Julian has given us so many different kinds of kids here, all of whom have their own stuff going on, and we get to find out about a good cross section of them who either befriend Jadon or, you know, wonder why the prince is actually in their midst and what that means for them.

He’s set up such a great community here. It’s something that we see in a lot of his books where we have a number of kids who are displayed on the page and each of these people who we get to kind of know in the book are really somebody who will have various impacts on Jadon as we go along, and it’s really great.

And one of those students happened to be Reiss. Reiss has pink hair. He is an aspiring filmmaker and he kind of keeps himself to himself in some ways but the sparks that fly between these two even when they first meet are so cute and adorable. And then they kind of like antagonize each other a little bit because Jadon has this idea of who he’s supposed to be and he’s trying to be that, but it’s not quite who he actually is. So it all comes off a little wrong.

But these two end up hanging out more and they really settle into something good until the paparazzi happens to catch them together. And through all this, Jadon is grappling with how is he supposed to be who his parents want him to be? How is that in conflict with who he is and what he believes in?

Julian does such a great job meshing all of these emotions together and trying to make Jadon into the best person that he is supposed to be and his journey to get there and how Reiss factors into that. I loved so much of this book and especially some of Jadon’s internal monologues as he’s kind of fighting with himself over what he’s supposed to be and how he’s supposed to be the prince that his kingdom deserves. And trying to kind of bring the monarchy a little bit into the future. We see that in some of these themes with “Red White and Royal Blue” and with “Young Royals,” and Julian’s bringing all that into the page here with such amazing characters.

As we learn more about the royal family and Jadon’s parents, we understand what they’ve been through because there are some similarities there because Jadon’s mom was actually born in the US and how his dad bringing her into the monarchy played itself out and how that’s still reverberating in the kingdom a little bit.

The setting in Santa Monica, which fans of Julian know that is one of his favorite places, is a character itself as Jadon explores the area, which is where his mom went to college and stuff.

It’s so, so good. And this romance that happens between the prince and the American boy is so well played out. It’s not pretty on some of the first meetings, as Reiss has to figure out what it means to be around Jadon and what that’s kinda like. But it all comes together so well. I just love this book so much. We’ve never seen Julian do any sequels of any kind in his work so far, but I would really love glimpses of these characters at some point in the future to see how things really work out for them and what their long term is.

So it was really exciting to have a brand new Julian Winters book to read in this late summertime, and I highly recommend that you pick up “Prince of the Palisades” if you’re a fan of Julian’s work or if you enjoyed “Red White, and Royal Blue” or “Young Royals,” you will not be disappointed by this one.

Alright, let’s get into cozy mysteries. I absolutely fell in love with T. Thorn Coyle’s “Pride Street Paranormal Mysteries.” These cozy mysteries feature human and animal detectives, and I have to tell you that Marsha the Corgi, as one of the animal detectives. She gets to tell half of the story and she is so awesome. Very no nonsense. Plus there’s a ghost who helps out too. And it’s all set in a vibrant queer neighborhood in Portland. There’s three books out right now, and Thorn has two more on the way this fall that they’re launching through a Kickstarter that begins next week. I had such a great time talking to Thorn about where these wonderful characters come from and what we can expect from the new installments in the series.

T. Thorn Coyle Interview

Jeff: Thorn, welcome to the podcast. I am so excited that you’re here.

Thorn: I’m excited too. I am thrilled actually. Thanks so much for having me on.

Jeff: Oh, absolutely. We met in Portland earlier this year, which seems like an eternity ago now, and you introduced me to the idea of these amazing paranormal cozy mysteries that you’ve got called “Price Street Paranormal.” And I got into them. I’m like, oh gosh, these are terrific, and you’ve got a new book on the way this fall. So yes, we have to talk about them. For people who may not know the “Pride Street” series, tell us all about the goings on here.

Thorn: So Pride Street is a fake neighborhood in Portland. I mean, it does have some real places in it that I reference, but it’s just a queer little neighborhood full of all sorts of wild characters who are just having a great time as mayhem is occurring.

So I get to write from a corgi’s point of view. So there’s a dog sleuth and then a human sleuth. And also a ghost, which is really fun to write. And the ghost, Adam, is very dear to my heart. He was an AIDS activist, leather daddy in the eighties. And, I was a teenager and young adult in my early twenties, in the late eighties, early nineties, during the height of the AIDS crisis. And so people like that… like I knew Adam. I knew ACT UP activists. I knew people chaining themselves to street cars. And I love writing him too.

But you know, it’s just a great thing to write a series and write about a neighborhood where being queer is just the normal thing. Early on, someone wrote a review of the first book, “Sushi Scandal” and they said, warning a non-binary character gets killed. But then they said, but they didn’t get killed because they were non-binary. So there’s a normalization of just living in community in that way that I really also have a great time writing. So yeah, mysteries occur.

Jeff: Mysteries occur, yeah. As happens in cozy mysteries.

Thorn: Yes.

Jeff: The community was so just wonderful. I mean, yes, in its inclusive nature that there’s a little bit of everybody in the community, but just the vibe of the street and the shops that are on the street and the cafes and everything. I’m curious, you mentioned some of these places are real. Which ones are kind of based on some real places that you’ve visited?

Thorn: Well, so there’s a sushi bar in my world. And then across the street from that is a bar bar, and that actually exists on Harvey Milk Street in Portland. So those are places are real. But there’s not Bruisers Cafe run by a lesbian couple and their bulldog. There’s not a vinyl store and animal pet supply store called Bones, Dogs and Harmony. So I just had fun filling out. I was like, well the street itself in Portland does not have a residential area near it. And I really wanted Pride Street to have a residential section. So I kind of glommed a couple neighborhoods together including like the old craftsmans and Victorians that we love up here in Portland, those sorts of buildings. So there are some. There’s definitely true stuff there, but most of it I just made up because I felt like it.

Jeff: I want you to become a city planner cause I wanna come live at this place.

Thorn: Right, right. I mean, I wanna live there too. I’m like, man, I wish I could just walk to this queer, fabulous neighborhood.

Jeff: Yeah, because it just… and the stores you put on it too, were like… I would totally go to the vinyl store and see what’s going on there. And I would totally go to this other place and check this out. And go to the new muffin place when it opened. All of that stuff. What inspired all of this for you to be like, I want to undertake this project and turn it into a series.

Thorn: Well, it started off during the… when the pandemic started I needed a break from writing my more serious books. I was in the middle of writing an action adventure fantasy trilogy, which is also filled with queer and diverse characters. And so I started writing my “Seashell Cove” paranormal cozy series, which is truly bonkers.

I mean, it is off the map in every way. And that’s set in a fake Oregon coast town. Again, a couple of towns glommed together. In writing that, I sent it to a friend of mine who was a traditional cozy author, and I said, would you just check the cozy vibes on this? Cause I’ve read a lot of cozy mysteries, but I’ve never written them.

And she said, well, the cozy vibe, you’ve hit it right on the nose. But you know some more cozy readers tend to be more traditional and you’ve got a bisexual lead. And her ex-girlfriend is dating a non-binary person. And I was like, you know what? I don’t care. So I launched it as cozy mysteries for freaks and geeks.

I’m like, we deserve cozy mysteries too. And it took off. It’s my best selling series now, this weird series. And then I was like, you know what? I wanna write another cozy series, slightly less bonkers and even more queer. And the characters just came to me. the corgis came to me, and Garrett, who’s a trans gay man in his relationship with his mystery and thriller writer partner John, who happened to live in this house haunted by this leather daddy activist ghost.

So I sort of just wanted another queer cozy series. The characters just started coming forward, which that’s how my creative process works. I really rarely sit down and plan out a series. I have done that with some of my series that are discreet, like my “Witches of Portland,” I knew it was gonna be a nine book series. Each coven member was gonna get a book.

But these cozies are ongoing and so I just sort of let the world and the characters build itself. And as you said, I just wanted to live on Pride Street. So I started writing it and I just wanted a world, a cozy world, where being a trans man married to another man and having two corgis was just ordinary.

Jeff: And the token ghost, cause, you know, why not.

Thorn: Why not have a token ghost? And I love it cause he, Adam, the ghost, gets to comment on how different things are these days than they were when he was living in that house in the eighties. So I get to co compare and contrast some things from my younger years with how things are now, which is also really satisfying.

Jeff: Which is a nice piece to be able to integrate a little, just bits of queer history because of how things have changed and how Adam would see it versus how Garrett and John get to live it.

Thorn: Yes, exactly. Yeah. In a way, you know, how Garrett and John live is a victory for Adam, right? And he didn’t get to experience that. He clearly had a rich, amazing life in his community. And so that’s the other thing is in all of my books, community is really important. There’s never a lone person figuring things out. Community action. I love writing teams and community action is really important to me. And so the community of Pride Street, it’s different from the community Adam lived in, but it’s still a vital, vibrant community. That has not been lost.

Jeff: Yeah, I love how this community rallies around whatever mystery is happening. It was like, we all kind of figure this out cause it affects all of us…

Thorn: Exactly.

Jeff: …the things that are happening here.

Thorn: Yeah. Whether it’s someone being killed or a cat getting kidnapped, it doesn’t matter. Yeah.

Jeff: Yeah. We gotta talk about Marsha the Corgi and, we’ll talk about Adam too, because I’ve never read, cozies in particular, but just books in general where you don’t often get the point of view of the dog or a ghost. Sometimes ghost depending on what you know, if you’re reading true paranormal. But POV from the dog was really fun and as I was doing it, I’m like, this is amazing cause you get to… In this world where you’re dealing with everything that the human world is dealing with, the dogs are dealing with it too. And the other animals on Pride Street all have this communication network going on. And Marsha, love her so much. She is so forthright cause it’s like that detective brain takes over and she’s in charge. How did she manifest in your mind to become this amazing character amongst the humans that were there already? Because it’s… I could read a book all about her and her point of view on things.

Thorn: When I write short stories in that world, they’re all from her point of view, which is really fun. Again, my subconscious just ran with this character. She had a clear voice immediately when I started writing her. She’s the most beautiful one. She’s the most intelligent one, and she’s in charge. And she’s going to let you know, right? And I just ran with that. And it’s a joy writing from the corgi’s point of view because the animals do get to see the world differently than the humans. So it’s like, well, what’s it like? First of all just to be short, to be that low to the ground. You’re dealing with shoes and boots you wanna bite. And oh, you don’t wanna bite the ghost boots though, even though they’re shiny leather because. Biting a ghost is a terrible thing, right? It’s yucky.

And the smells. And they’re picking up different clues than the humans can because they see differently, they use their senses differently. And so I can’t really explain it other than my subconscious latched onto her character and it just started running. I’m not a plotter. I might have an idea for like what the core mystery might be when I start out, but really I just follow the characters around. So voicey characters are fun to follow around.

Jeff: Oh sure. I’m always impressed by mystery and thriller writers who can do it without planning it. I’m not a hundred percent plotter or a hundred percent pantser, but like when I do that more of a vibe, I’ve gotta at least know this person did it and this is the things that I have to seed to make sure I hit it.

And yet here you’ve got tremendous stuff. Like, coming back to Marsha, it’s like we all need to be looking out for the red car, for example. Or how are we gonna get the humans to come understand this thing that we all know now because of a smell or something somebody saw or whatever that is.

Thorn: Well, and that’s where the ghost often comes in. The ghost will help the dogs try to communicate to the humans, which is interesting interaction.

Jeff: It’s an interesting game of telephone between the dogs and the ghost and the humans.

Thorn: So what I do, if I know too far in advance who done it, I can’t write the book because I wanna race there too quickly. I don’t wanna let the story unfold as it needs to. So sometimes, like the a book I’m writing now, I thought I knew what had happened and it’s already changed. I’ve already changed it. I’ve already let the characters make a bigger mess that I’m gonna have to unravel at the end. So often what I have to do is I have to then cycle back. And make sure my clues are solid, right? My subconscious plants a lot of clues that I trace.

And so the way I outline is after I write the chapters, I’ll make a note. So then I remember, oh, that clue came in chapter 14, right? So do I need to expand on that more? Do I need to cycle back and clean it up? Things like that happen. So I cycle a lot to kind of iron out the clues as I go.

But yeah, if I had it figured out, I couldn’t write it, which is nice cause it means they’re not formulaic cause they can’t be cause I don’t even know what’s gonna happen.

Jeff: I mean, in all three of these, I could not pin it on who I thought had done it. I was always wrong.

Thorn: That’s terrific.

Jeff: Which I like. I don’t wanna figure it out on chapter two and so I’m like, oh, it’s gotta be that person. Like, oh, well no, it’s not that person. What about this? I like being able to hold the mystery on, who it was until we get much closer to who is being revealed. And even then, I’m like, oh, okay.

Thorn: I mean my… the front of my brain, my conscious, critical brain, it just is not that smart, right? My subconscious is very smart. It knows how to seed all the clues that I can follow, like breadcrumbs. But if I had to figure it all out, I think it would be boring.

Jeff: Do you kind of just navigate then chapter to chapter like, who’s going to take the POV role, whether it’s Garrett or Marsha or Adam, or…

Thorn: With Garrett and Marsha, I try to switch off chapter to chapter. I don’t always, but that’s mostly what I try to do. And then Adam comes in like every 10 or so chapters approximately. I just… I know, huh? I haven’t really heard directly from Adam in a while. He needs to get a chapter again, right? And the book’s always open with Marsha and close with Adam. That’s kind of the only thing I’m clear on. And then mostly Garrett and Marsha flip flop. They trade off.

Jeff: I do like the bookending between Marsha and Adam. It’s just kind of a nice way to get into things to see what’s going on in the world. And then it’s a nice coda for Adam, really. I don’t know how to better put it than that.

Thorn: Yeah, He is able to thoughtfully wrap things up which I like. I appreciate his voice. He’s a very thoughtful character. Whereas Marsha is very, willful and active. And Garrett is a little more shy and reserved and smart in a different way than Marsha is smart.

Jeff: And then there’s everyone who lives on Pride Street, you have such an amazing cast of humans and pets. The parrot whose name I’m forgetting at the moment.

Thorn: Josephine Baker, the African gray parrot.

Jeff: Is amazing and her relationships to the dogs.

Thorn: Yeah. Yeah. The dogs don’t like her very much cause she’s too loud.

Jeff: But has things to say.

Thorn: She does. Yeah, she does.

Jeff: I assume those just kind of grew organically too, is you needed both humans and pets to populate the space.

Thorn: Yeah. It’s funny. Like Bruiser the bulldog came because the name of the cafe was Bruiser’s Best Beans. And it’s like, well that’s because Bruiser is the dog at the cafe, right? And I don’t know where Josephine Baker came from because Ron, the owner of that store, the vinyl store, already has the dog, Fred, who’s a very calm, black retriever, older, very steady and stable. He kind of evens things out. He’s the voice of reason among the animals. And I think because of that, and Ron is also a very steady human character. And I think because of that, I needed a wild card. The parrot is just a wild card. She just is random and as you said, has things to say, and is loud, kind of obnoxious. So she counterbalances the steadiness of Fred and Ron, I think.

Jeff: Do you have a favorite supporting character to write? I’m not gonna make you pick a favorite character among the primary five cause that’s a little difficult, I think. But in those supporting characters, are there ones that are more fun to write.

Thorn: I really enjoy writing Princess Sparkle Toes is really fun.

Jeff: It’s such a great name.

Thorn: Yeah. Yeah. Princess Sparkle Toes, aka PST. She is really a fun character to write because she’s very dramatic. She is larger than life. And for people who haven’t read this series, her animal is Mr. Cheeks the hamster, and she carries him around in a little pink ventilated hamster purse, which is just a joy to write too. It’s like, wow, what a great character. And Mr. Cheeks is a fun character too. He’s very sincere.

Jeff: Poor Marsha just doesn’t seem to understand being carried around in the little hamster purse.

Thorn: No, she thinks it’s degrading and weird. But you know, when you’re a hamster you gotta be carried around somehow. It’s either that or stay home.

Jeff: Yeah. Getting you out in the world, which is not a bad thing.

Thorn: Also just the thought of a hamster purse. It amuses me, it’s just something my brain kicked up and Makes me happy.

Jeff: It could become merch. If you ever wanted to expand in the books.

Thorn: Right.

Jeff: You’ve got a fourth book coming out this fall, what do we get to find in the fourth book? What can you tease us about?

Thorn: So the fourth book is called “Hairspray Horror.” And “Hairspray Horror” has a hair salon and drag queens. So hairspray in both places, right? And a drag queen at Enrico’s Nightclub, which is a recurring venue in the series. A drag queen drops dead and there’s a lot of mystery that happens around it. And in that book, Klaus ends up in actual danger for the first time. So they have to solve that part too. So that’s about all I’ll say about that.

And then there will also be a fifth book called “Dandy Distress,” which has to do with a costume designer and a tailor who ends up missing. So there will be two books coming out in the Kickstarter in September.

Jeff: Oh, fantastic. I didn’t know we were gonna get two at the same time. That’s super exciting.

Thorn: Yeah.

Jeff: Tell us about the Kickstarter and what people are gonna be able to pick up. That starts on September 3rd, right?

Thorn: Yeah, it does. It starts on September 3rd. It’ll run for around three weeks and people will be able to get all five books. So the two new ones, but if you’re new to the series, you can get the first three. I have commissioned wonderful character art from a trans-masculine artist, Thistle Arts. He just did a terrific job with Garrett, John, and the two dogs, Klaus and Marsha. So I’ll have merch with the character art. I’m working on fabulous pins and t-shirts and a bunch of other goodies. If we hit some stretch rewards, there will be new short stories and not even sure what else. A whole lot of different fun things will be happening, but mostly it centers around the five books that you can get in ebook or paperback.

Jeff: That’s exciting. I can tell I’m gonna be dropping some money on a Kickstarter very soon. I can’t wait to see the character art cause I can only imagine. You know what the guys and the dogs look like. Does Adam get some art too? Somehow drawing ghost…

Thorn: Adam doesn’t yet have art, but you know, that might end up being a stretch goal. Because Adam deserves some art. Right now the character art is just the two dogs and John and Garrett, which it’s really fun seeing them from an artist’s point of view. Yeah. And it’s beautiful.

Jeff: That’s gonna be so cool I can’t wait. Now you’ve got me even more excited than I was in the first place for book four.

Thorn: Thank you so much.

Jeff: I meant to ask too, naming all of these places. I love finding out how people decide to name like the stores and everything. And where do you come up with those from? Because there’s some nice puns in there for some of them.

Thorn: Yeah. It’s funny because I am not personally a very punny person, but something about the cozy vibe, the cozy voice, and this neighborhood, it lends itself to kind of quirky punny names. And so I just had fun with the names too. Like the sushi place is How We Roll. The convenience store is At Your Convenience. Then Bones, Dogs, and Harmony, clearly that’s a play on Bone Thugs-N-Harmony, and Mystic Muffins. Yeah, I don’t know. I just… Again, it’s just all play for me coming up with those names and populating the neighborhood with kind of quirky… Like Garrett’s shop is Dandy Lion’s Design and Decor, cause he’s a dandy, he always has been a dandy. And so of course his shop is Dandy Lion, which then of course harkens back to “Wizard of Oz,” the gay lion that we know from our childhood, right?

Jeff: I just envision… like I have this whole setup in my head of what Pride Street looks like with the various signs and what the street looks like and the cafe spread out and everybody’s kind of just hanging out on the sidewalk, coming and going to all these places. It’s just a nice place in my head now.

Thorn: Good. Good. Yeah. It’s a place you wanna visit.

Jeff: Besides “Pride Street,” you’ve mentioned a couple other series that you’ve got. A cozy series, the fantasy series. Give our listeners an idea of what the T. Thorn Coyle universe of story looks like cause there’s a lot of stuff there that people can go pick up, even if cozies aren’t quite their thing.

Thorn: Yeah, so the “Witches of Portland” is my main, nine book, urban fantasy series. Again, very community oriented. It’s a nine person coven. Each coven member gets their own book, but the whole coven works to solve the problem in each book and they’re very concerned with justice. Actually all my series are. My author tagline is, “Magic is real. Justice is worth fighting for.” So all my books have an element of magic and justice in them.

And then I’ve got a four book series called “The Panther Chronicles,” which is my alt history urban fantasy, that I wanted to answer the question, what would’ve happened if Fred Hampton of the Black Panthers had not been assassinated. And what would’ve happened if the Black Panther party leadership were shapeshifters. So that’s my alt history, urban fantasy.

I’ve got a brand new cozy novella fantasy series called “The Mouse Thief,” which is told from a mouse’s point of view. He wears a highway men’s coat and a tricorn hat, and has a fun crew. I call it “Leverage” meets “Legends and Lattes,” if people like either of those. I loved the series “Leverage” and I love capers and heists and where the crew of miscreants takes on evil people. And so that’s what “The Mouse Thief” series is all about.

And then I write nonfiction, mostly on magical practice. Although I’ve also recently came out with “The Midlist Indie Author Mindset” book, which will be available this fall for general sale. And then my short stories are all over the map. I write science fiction, time travel, romance, thriller, pretty much everything in short fiction. I play a lot in short fiction. So yeah, I kind of write all over the map, but there’s always that thread of magic and justice through everything, and community action.

Jeff: What is it about magic that it’s in your nonfiction and your fiction, and what drew you into that to make it such a cornerstone?

Thorn: When I was very young, I realized that the thing I loved most was the thought that something magical could be around every corner in the most ordinary circumstance, right? There’s a sense of wonder in the world that I still try to cultivate. That’s really important to me. And so there was that part.

And then when I was a teenager, I first heard about animism, that the world is a living place, it’s not inert. And I was like, that’s right. That’s what I believe. And looking at the world through an animist viewpoint increases my sense of magic and wonder in the world.

And all children are animists, right? Your stuffed animals are actual beings that you interact with. They’re not just stuffing and cloth. And so to take that out to like the trees and the rocks and the insects and the birds. Everything’s alive. Everything’s co-creating this wonderful world together.

And the world can be a harsh and terrible place and really painful place, as we know. Cultivating that sense of magic gets me through. When my heart is broken because the world is so terrible and another terrible thing has happened, I return to that sense of wonder and say, how can I seed more magic in the world. It gives people hope. I think we need hope to keep going and to keep taking care of each other and the planet. So that’s why magic is so central to me, to my life, and to my art, to my writing.

Jeff: Hearing you say all that, I mean it coalesces for me, like the vibe that I had reading these “Pride Street” books cause there is a sense of hope and a community that gets along well, takes care of its own.

Thorn: Yeah.

Jeff: And that all of these different elements come together to work together. The humans with the dogs, with the ghost, they’re not all speaking the same language. Sometimes they can’t even speak directly to each other, but it all kind of connects in different ways and just makes this wonderful place to hang out for the span of a book.

Thorn: Yeah. That’s always my hope so I’m really glad that comes through for you. Thank you.

Jeff: And I gotta read “The Mouse Thief” books cause I love a good heist and I can’t imagine how the mouse gets to go around solving the heist that happens.

Thorn: He’s got a crew. Theodore the mouse has a whole crew so they all, again, work together just like they do on “Leverage” and solve these kind of pseudo fantasy 17th century mysteries,

Jeff: Have you always written animals in this way too? Or is this something that has kind of cropped up in the cozy space?

Thorn: This cropped up in the cozy space. Yeah. I have not written animals like this before. That really emerged in “Seashell Cove.” There’s a cat. It’s a witch and her cat. The first book of that is “Bookshop Witch.” So the cat Rhiannon is… she started off not being able to speak and ended up figuring out how to telepathically speak to her humans.

So she’s grown more and more voicey as the series has gone on. So yeah, it emerged through the cozy space. It’s a natural. Years ago I read the Rita Mae Brown “Sneaky Pie Brown” books, which, has animals in it. And then there’s the Carole. Gosh, what’s her name? The “Midnight Louie” books I apologize for blanking on the author’s name. That also has a cat who’s a protagonist. So those definitely exist in the cozy space and I brought that forward cause why not?

Jeff: Yeah, why not? It makes me want to go see if I could write animals cause it sounds so much fun.

Thorn: It’s really liberating. I encourage you to try it.

Jeff: You also teach magical practice, kind of coming back to that a little bit. What does that mean to do that? I’m curious cause that’s a new concept to me.

Thorn: That was kind of the previous iteration in my career. I used to travel all over the globe teaching workshops. So it’s personal, spiritual practice linked to community as always. And again, it’s about instilling us as individuals with that sense of wonder and that we have the ability to change things through conscious action, right?

So we do focused spell work, for example, to say, I want to affect this thing in my life or in my community. How do we do this as individuals? How do we work together to make this change together. So there has to be, yes, a practical, real world application, but it starts with shifting consciousness.

I shift my consciousness towards hope. I shift my consciousness towards justice. Rather than getting bogged down by everything that feels heavy in the world, can I bring some of that magical focus to apply to what feels heavy and difficult?

So the more I can work on myself and become aligned in myself, like I do meditation practice every day to start my day. So I start my day with a template that I have something calm inside of me. I have a way to center myself. And then I can act from that centered place instead of just acting frantically and with no foundation. So for me, magical practice and teaching magical practice is about teaching people how to take responsibility for creating a good foundation for themselves and their communities so that we can build a better world together.

Jeff: Sounds like something we all need in these days for sure.

Thorn: Yeah. By whatever means we get to it, I’m for it.

Jeff: You mentioned the “Midlist Author” book as well. Will has read that because we backed the Kickstarter and he absolutely loved it. There’s certainly authors in our audience. Tell us a little bit about that too, in case they wanna pick it up when it comes wide later this fall.

Thorn: Yeah, it’ll be out in October. It’s “The Midlist Indie Author Mindset”. And I wrote that book because early on when I returned to writing fiction, I was listening to people, their business advice, and trying to do it, and I was spending money on classes and spending money on marketing that didn’t work for me.

I am an idiosyncratic person, and for me marketing is all about connecting with other people. So I had to figure out for myself. I had to shift my mindset away from, here’s the way it has to be done. Here’s the only way it can be done. Authors also said, stay in your lane. And write to market. And you can’t publish your nonfiction and your novels under the same name, you’ll ruin the algorithm. And I’m like, I don’t care about the algorithm. And of course since then the algorithm has changed a million times, right? So the people who were gaming the algorithm eight years ago, can no longer do it that way, right?

So I knew I needed to stick with my inner voice and find my own process. And so I wanted to write something to help other people find their personal process. What’s your idiosyncratic way? What’s gonna work for your career? And yes, here are some basic core practices, business practices that we need to learn. But we’re all going to enact them differently.

Like my friend saying traditional cozy readers aren’t gonna want books with bisexual and non-binary characters. I had to say I don’t care, and I marketed the heck out of it. Cozy mysteries for freaks and geeks and lo and behold, people love those books. My readership is out there. I just had to find a way to be true to myself to reach readers. So there’s a lot of mindset. There’s a lot of practical stuff in the book, but there’s also a lot of mindset practices in that book to help us uncover what our best business practices are.

So far, from the Kickstarter, it’s gotten a great response from people who’ve read it, which is heartening to me because you never know when you write something like that, is it gonna resonate with people or not? And so I’m so grateful that it’s resonating with other authors.

Jeff: Yeah, I mean within minutes of Will finishing it, he came as like, you really have to read this. Make sure it’s on your list to read. Yes, it’s on my list, but I’ll move it up the list now.

Thorn: That’s so nice to hear. Thank you so much.

Jeff: You’ve got a lot on deck as we head towards the end of the year. Two new “Pride Street” books connected to a Kickstarter. “Midlist Indie Author” coming out in October. What else can you tell us is coming that we should be looking out for on the further horizon there?

Thorn: Well, last year I also Kickstarted a book, a nonfiction book, “You Are The Spell” and I did my first oracle deck that goes with it, which is a series of cards you can just pull to use as a meditation every day. And so that’s gonna be coming out later this year as well. And so I’m excited about that.

And then I have plans to write more “Mouse Thief” books. I have plans to write more “Seashell Cove” books. I now have three ongoing series that I didn’t really expect, and so I’m just gonna let myself play. I’ll figure out which one I wanna write next, but right now I’ve gotta, as you said, finish what’s on deck.

Jeff: And it’s not an insignificant amount that’s on deck.

Thorn: No, like so many of us, I have more ideas than I have time to bring to fruition. So I just do my best.

Jeff: I like the freedom you give yourself to just decide, like when these things are cleared up a little bit, you’re gonna pick what kinda resonates with you in the moment and go write that.

Thorn: Yeah, exactly. Keeps it fun.

Jeff: Yeah. So as we wrap up, we’ve absolutely gotta get some recommendations. What are you reading or watching that you would recommend to our listeners?

Thorn: Well, this series is already complete in three seasons, but if people haven’t seen it yet, I love “Sort Of.” I don’t know if you’ve watched it. “Sort Of” is a wonderful queer, genderqueer, Pakistani-Canadian television series. It’s got three seasons. It’s set in the art scene. And the actors are all amazing. So it’s a wonderful amalgamation of queer community, Pakistani-Canadian community and how they all interact with each other, the arts community. And I just loved the characters. It’s full of heart. And the actors are amazing. So I highly recommend “Sort of.” That’s one thing.

And then books, I’m reading a lot of historical mysteries and some cozy mysteries. I also have more books on my Kickstarter to be read pile. I back so many books on Kickstarter. I love… it’s one of my favorite ways to get books now. So I’ve got a lot of books in my library from that are on my TBR pile. Historical mysteries, I just read a series by CJ Archer that I enjoyed. And I’m also liking, for cozies Mia Manansala, the first book in that series is called “Arsenic and Adobo.” So those are really fun stories also. Again, with a different culture than I’m used to. I like reading outside my white culture of white middle class kind of culture. Although I was raised working class, but these days I’m middle class. And so it’s a good voice to that series.

Jeff: I always enjoy hearing how people find things on Kickstarter. How do you use Kickstarter to find the book that you want. Are you just on all the good lists that people email you and go, I have… this book is coming? Or are you able to search well on Kickstarter to find books that you are interested in?

Thorn: I do both. First of all, a lot of my friends launch on Kickstarter, so I’m always happy to support their projects. I’m also part of a group on Facebook. I’m one of the moderators for Kickstarter for Authors, and so there are a ton of projects always being launched through that group, and so I get to pick which ones are interesting to me.

But I do also just go on the platform and you can search for “Viking fantasy” or “science fiction.” You can search for anything in the fiction department on Kickstarter. And so I find a lot of new to me authors that way, which is really fun. Since I don’t read fiction in print much anymore, I tend to read fiction on ebooks, I can’t go into a bookstore and browse and see what the proprietor might be recommending. So Kickstarter’s a great way to find new to me authors.

Jeff: I have the same problem with print. I love print books. I own many print books. I still buy many print books, but if I’m gonna read, I need an ebook or an audiobook to do that.

Thorn: Yeah. I read nonfiction in paper and fiction as ebook. I also get a lot of enooks from my library, so I discover books that way too. The librarians do recommend things on the ebook app, which is nice.

Jeff: That’s nice. Yeah, a librarian pick is always worth its weight in gold usually.

Thorn: Yeah. Heck yeah.

Jeff: So what’s the best way for everybody to keep up with you online so they know more about the Kickstarter as you start talking about it and it kicks off in a week or so, and then everything else is gonna be coming out.

Thorn: Well, if you go to my website, ThornCoyle.com, you can sign up for my newsletter. I send out a weekly newsletter. That’s just my musings, what I’m thinking about this week and a photograph I’ve taken on one of my walks. And then underneath my short newsletter, I always put a book that’s coming out or a Kickstarter that’s coming up so people can do that.

I’ve got a Patreon. I’m on pretty much all the social media sites, including Mastodon. I also have a direct store, ThornCoyleBooks.com. But yeah, my weekly newsletter is really the best way to keep up with what’s happening.

Jeff: Fantastic. We will link to all of those things and everything we talked about in our conversation. Thank you so much for coming and sharing more about “Pride Street” and everything else that you’re writing with our listeners. I really hope they go pick up these amazing books.

Thorn: Thank you again, Jeff. This has been a great conversation. You’re a delightful human and I’m happy to talk to you at any time.

Wrap-Up

Will: This episode’s transcript has been brought to you by our community on Patreon. If you’d like to read the conversation for yourself, head on over to the show notes page for this episode at BigGayFictionPodcast.com. We’ve got links to everything that we’ve talked about in this episode.

Jeff: And thanks so much to Thorn for taking the time to talk to us about “Pride Street Paranormal” and their other series as well. I love that they cut across so many genres and blazed their own path that works for them, especially the message that their storytelling is a form of play. And I have to admit that I still haven’t read the “Midlist Indie Author Mindset” book, but that is on the horizon in the next couple of weeks as I finish up some other books I need to read for the podcast.

Now, let’s get another take on the interview. Hey, ChatGPT, I’d love to know what you think are the three most interesting things from the conversation with Thorn.

ChatGPT: Sure Jeff, here are three aspects that stand out.

First, Thorn’s “Pride Street Paranormal” series is set in a fictional queer neighborhood in Portland filled with vibrant characters, including a corgi sleuth, a trans gay man, and a ghost who was an AIDS activist. The idea of having a diverse and inclusive community as the backdrop for cozy mysteries is refreshing and unique. The integration of animals and a ghost as part of the detective team adds a fun and imaginative twist, making the series stand out in the cozy mystery genre.

Second, Thorn emphasizes the significance of community and representation in their work. They talk about creating a world where being queer is normalized and celebrated, reflecting their own experiences and the communities they value. The fact that the community rallies together to solve mysteries, whether it’s a murder or a missing cat, highlights the importance of collective action and support. This focus on community action and justice is a central theme across Thorn’s work, showcasing their commitment to writing stories that resonate with diverse audiences.

And third, Thorn’s approach to writing is intuitive and character-driven. They don’t plan their mysteries extensively, instead allowing the characters and story to unfold naturally. This organic process leads to unexpected twists and a non-formulaic structure, which keeps readers engaged and surprised. Thorn also discusses how they incorporate personal experiences and historical elements, such as the AIDS crisis, into their stories, adding depth and authenticity to their work. Their emphasis on magic, justice, and hope in storytelling is also noteworthy, as it reflects their broader philosophy and desire to inspire readers.

These aspects of Thorn’s work and philosophy highlight their innovative approach to writing and storytelling, making their books appealing to a wide range of readers.

Jeff: Chat picked out some great things there, especially focusing on Adam and Marsha. I really loved hearing from Thorn on how much they love writing those characters, and in particular how Adam connects to their past.

Will: All right, I think that’ll do it for now. Coming up next on Monday, September 9th, Merry Farmer joins us to talk about her latest book, “Thrown,” a contemporary enemies to lover romance that kicks off the brand new “Art of Love” series.

Jeff: Let me tell you, the fiery clashes between Robbie and Toby with the backdrop of keeping Robbie’s family estate and art school afloat, pulled me in so fast. I loved talking to Merry about this book and the real life inspiration behind the series.

Will: Thank you so much for listening. We hope that you’ll join us again soon for more discussions about the kinds of stories we all love, the big gay fiction kind. Until then, keep turning those pages and keep reading.

Big Gay Fiction Podcast is part of the Frolic Podcast Network. Find more shows you’ll love at frolic.media/podcasts. Original theme music by Daryl Banner.

 

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4 Comments

  1. Katherine
    Katherine on August 29, 2024 at 5:13 pm

    So many thoughts. I want to live on Pride Street, going to Bruiser’s Cafe to visit with friends and have some refreshment. Your conversation about animals who solve mysteries reminded me of the Lillian Jackson Braun Cath Who… series. I enjoyed seeing Koko and Yum Yum figure out what happened.

    It is a pleasure to spend time with you and your guests while out on my lunchtime walk.

    • Jeff
      Jeff on August 31, 2024 at 9:52 am

      Pride Street would be so amazing in real life! So glad you enjoyed this interview. I love knowing that we’re out walking with you.

  2. Thorn Coyle
    Thorn Coyle on September 3, 2024 at 1:38 pm

    Thanks so much, Jeff! I loved talking with you.

    • Jeff
      Jeff on September 3, 2024 at 3:17 pm

      I had such a great time talking with you! And now I’m off to back a Kickstarter. 🙂